As Los Angeles continues to centralize into a more compact city (into Downtown LA and environs) and the metro system continues to attract a higher and higher ridership, we must continue to upgrade and modernize our system to make it as comfortable and clean as possible as other mature urban cities have done with their metro systems
A couple of weeks ago I attended the ARA (AIDS Research Alliance) fundraiser in Downtown LA hosted at Cicada Restaurant on the ground floor of the beautiful historic 1927 Oviatt Building. I met a gentleman from San Francisco named Steve Villano who flew down to LA just for this fundraiser.
We chatted a little bit about the Downtown LA renaissance and how mass transit will play a more-than significant role in LA’s revitalization as a energetic urban city. He was telling me how much he loves Downtown LA because of its authentic urban landscape (compared with the rest of a very much suburban region) and all the tremendous changes that have been happening downtown lately such as LA Live and the countless restaurants popping up.
He also told me that he was planning on using our metro system for the very first time by walking up to the 7th/Metro station from his hotel in South Park (the O Hotel) and taking the subway to Union Station to catch the Amtrak down to San Diego before flying back up to San Francisco. I thought it would be great to get the opinion from someone with “virgin eyes,” so I asked him if he would be willing to let me know what he thought about our metro after using it.
Lo and behold, Steve kept his word and emailed me last week with his thoughts:
The ride on Metro was easy, but a bit strange.
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It was a very easy walk from the O Hotel to [7th/Metro] Metro Center, and we were greeted outside by one of Downtown’s “Purple” guides, who was tremendously helpful. Going down the escalator was easy, and I was impressed by the cleanliness of the entrance area to the station–something we don’t always have in SF, and we frequently didn’t have when I lived in NYC. The fare machines were easy to operate, and the fare of $1.50 was a real bargain, compared to both SF and NYC.
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But here’s where the strangeness came in: None of the turnstiles worked. We put our fare cards against the spots on the turnstiles designated to read them, but nothing worked. One gate–usually used for the disabled–was wide open and everyone was going through it, with or without tickets. So, we followed the crowd since it was the only way to the trains, but felt strange doing it, and also felt that the Metro was loosing a helluva lot of money from this glitch at a major station. Once past the turnstile, we could not locate any signs that said “to Union Station,” which the Purple Guide said we would. Nothing was well marked. Only after several minutes of searching, when a Transit worker rushed by did we find out, when I shouted out, “Which way to Union Station?,” and he shouted back, “the other side.”
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Since we just missed one train, we only had to wait four or five minutes for another, which was posted clearly on the digital electronic board down on the platform. The crowd waiting on the platform was very sparse, and there were no other transit workers in sight, or “Purple” guides, whose presence on the train platform would have been greatly appreciated. Once on the Platform the maps were clearly marked. The train to Union Station arrived on schedule, and only took about 5-8 minutes to get there. The train cars however, were dreary and grimy looking, with blue material seats that looked like they hadn’t been cleaned in a while, and wobbly yellow lighting that was depressing. Brighter lights and brighter colored plastic (easy to scrub clean) seats would go a long way to improving the Metro-riding experience, as would platform attendants who could serve as Downtown LA “Ambassadors.”
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When we arrived at Union Station the signs were well-marked to get to Amtrak. We were glad we took the Metro, but we are urbanites and have ridden subway systems all over the world–including the NYC Subway system before it was upgraded and renovated in the 1980′s. To attract more riders who are new to the trains, LA needs to do a lot more to make it a pleasant, easy, welcoming experience. I’d call upon that long-time LA resident, the Walt Disney Company, to do a pro-bono analysis and demonstration of how to upgrade Metro service, so that Angelinos and visitors want to ride it as much as they enjoy riding on a Disney train.
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Thanks for reaching out and giving me the opportunity to send you my comments. –Steve Villano
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Since the turnstile issue is
already being worked on, I want to direct the attention to some other issues that have been bothering me about LA’s metro system. I especially agree with Steve that the next thing we should do is change out those
nasty upholstered seats (that I rarely sit on) and replace them with cleaner plastic ones like in New York or Boston. Even
SF BART is considering changing out the cushion seats in favor of plastic ones because of the billions of bacteria and viruses that infest these cushions.
Imagine the millions of different people a year–all with varying levels of personal hygiene–sitting on these upholstered seats (germ magnets), in addition to those who rest their germ infested (E. coli?) shoes/feet on the seats as well. Not a great incentive to sit down if LA Metro’s intention is to make it more “comfortable” for people to ride the train.
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Los Angeles Metro Upholstered Seats :(
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The blue upholstered seats in LA’s metro are not only a bit dowdy looking but have become generally dirty, and sometimes even filthy, as many people insist on putting their feet/shoes on the seats
Gum (and who knows what else) on the upholstered seats make it very unpleasant to sit on
Wears and tears over the years give our metro a bad image to discretionary riders, who we definitely want to attract more of to boost overall ridership
New York City Metro Plastic Seats :)
The wide and spacious cars of the New York City metro with the smooth plastic seats make for a much more enjoyable ride compared to the more cramped and dingy feel of the LA subway
Madrid Metro Plastic Seats :)
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Madrid is another city I have been to where I was very impressed by how clean and modern their metro system was, and again, with the smooth plastic seats that are much cleaner than your upholstered ones in LA’s subway system
Also, Let’s Switch to Countdown Timers in the LA Metro!
Fred Camino of The Source was the first person to point out to me over a year ago that we should switch to the easier to read and quick-to-grasp countdown timer instead of the current “scheduled timer” which you must know what time it is in order to know when the next train is coming
New York City is switching to the countdown timers as I saw in this subway car ad several months ago
Countdown timers are being rolled out all across the New York City metro system that should nudge LA to do the same thing
Even Salt Lake City’s metro system is rolling out countdown timers as I snapped this picture a few months ago
The Madrid metro system uses all countdown timers as well as I saw on my trip there this past summer
Great article and input from an ‘outsider.”
I have seen improvements in Metro in the past few months (since a new director took over). The announcements on the train are now a recording and spoken and very clear english. They’ve added Metrolink trains for things like Angels games. (Never made sense to me why there was not trains waiting after games). And they’ve removed some seats on the trains to make more room for bicycles.
It’s becoming, and will continue to become, a better system to compete with other major cities.
LA Metro (LACMTA) and “Metrolink” (SCRRA) are two separate agencies.
LA Metro is one of the five-six “county” members on the SCRRA board, but the two are not related except in that they both require taxpayer assistance.
Chicago also has a countdown timer which I’ve found much easier than LA’s. Another thing I wondered about is if they have a bus/rail tracker website/app like Chicago. This makes it so much more convenient, so I can tell when the next bus or train will come without waiting.
Hi Mike, yes we do have GPS tracking for our buses, and from what I understand, will also be rolled out on our trains, which will hopefully lead to the countdown timer.
Here is more info:
http://www.metro.net/service/nextrip/
GPS underground? I’d like to see that!
Also, the city should put up more obvious signs to the Metro trains from the street level. Many many times before, a tourist would ask me where the Metro station is and we are right there by the entrance…..if you don’t look hard enough, you wont see it.
The current Metro subway screens have poor balance of information priority and bad screen placement. The information that riders need everyday is the actual schedule (or yes, countdown), which is pushed off to the small-fonted sidebar. This makes it unreadable at much of a distance. There should be a big rethinking of how to deliver information on these screens.
Metro should partner with regular riders and strangers to the system to find out which monitor placements are working and which are completely useless. Monitors with bus connections that are placed just before the escalator instead of mid-way or at the top of the escalator are especially unhelpful. They are easily missed as you navigate from escalator to mezzanine to escalator, and if you do spot them you have to stop and block traffic to parse the information for bus location and times.
MyDTLA, I agree that they need much better signage outside the station. Just yesterday, I was at the southwestern corner of Wilshire and Western, when a woman stopped me and asked “Is there a train station somewhere around here?” I pointed to the Wilshire/Western station just across the street. When I looked, I realized why she couldn’t see a station right in front of her: the signage is 2-dimensional, and not visible from all sides. The escalator is hidden from view, and if you don’t notice the elevator then there’s nothing else to indicate that its a metro station and not just a plaza in front of the Solair bldg.
Regarding the cleanliness of the seats, I agree that tearing the apholstary would go a long way. At least its not like the DC metro though- where the seats are COVERED in apolstary and the floors are carpeted! They have to steam clean it every week, and it still looks dirty.
That yellow lighting has got to go too. So. Depressing.
Great article.
As far as “countdown timers” in subway, unfortunately our electronic timers (in our LA subway) never ever show the actual times: it’s only “scheduled” times which can be completely irrelevant to the actual train arrival time. In other words, those times on the electronic board are preset, so if the train is running late, the electronic board will never show it. So, the first step for MTA would be to implement real-time arrival info, not the pre-set, pre-typed times.
Smooth plastic seats would be an immediate magnet for graffiti; for those around long enough to remember, the RTD’s bus seats were like that. The whole idea behind scruffy, multicolor pattern upholstered seats was to make both markers and inscriptions difficult to stand out and thus discouraged.
P.S. About the idea of plastic seats, I disagree. Looks too mediocre, primitive, and is very tiring to sit on. I’ve ridden trains in New York, and other cities, with such hard-plastic seats; they’re horrible. Especially for elderly folks, people with back problems – sitting for long times on those horrible hard seats may aggravate the back pain, seriously!
I actually think currently layout and upholstery of Metro-train seats in LA is one of the most comfortable and sophisticated seats in the world! :) I hope Metro will continue its current scheme.
The longest single-seat ride on LA Metro currently is about 45-50 minutes (Blue Line); Red Line takes 30 minutes to go from LAUS to North Hollywood.
Let me respectfully disagree with y’all about plastic seating. I’m from Chicago, where upholstered seating was replaced with plastic in the late sixties because kids were tearing apart the upholstery with their pocket knives. From then on, I stuck to the seats every summer until the plastic seats were modified with upholstery pads, much like those used in El Lay. The colorfulness of the upholstery brightens up the cars and gives them a more pleasant feel, unlike the prison cell feeling of all plastic seats. Yes, it can be a problem to keep them clean, but they are easily removable for cleaning and replacement. Once the yahoos start scratching the all plastic seats with whatever weapons they have at hand, there is no way to repair them other than to replace the entire seating unit. Please be careful what you wish for!
The Upholstery isn’t the problem. The blue cloth remind me of Portland and Munich transit vehicles and are the warmest friendliest sight in an otherwise unattractive setting. The problem is that the subway cars were designed to feel 20 years old from the beginning. The nasty off white plastic looks like it’s been subjected to decades of cigarette smoke, the subway cars are totally lacking in up to date electronic information or even decent maps, the lighting sucks, the platforms feel decades older than they are and I never seem to know which way the train is headed. The plastic seat itself reminds me of a 1980s McDonalds swivel seat. That hard glossy plastic looks nasty and cheap. The blue cloth is the one bright spot for me. Google images of Trimet buses and light rail or Munich MVV S bahn innenraum and you see how blue upholstery works well when it is a part of a well designed interior. Could it be that you are fixating on the blue seats because of that well publicized study of Bart seats, which are far dirtier than ours?
“The problem is that the subway cars were designed to feel 20 years old”
That’s because they are currently 23 years old!
James,
+1 for complaining about the off-white walls. I hate them too. They look dirty and/or sun damaged. What’s wrong with just going all the way white?
I have to agree with some and disagree with others in that I like the “upholstered” seats. It adds color and discourages graffiti. The upholstery is designed to be easily and cheaply replaceable if needed. There is the occasional dirty seat, but I’ve never really had an issue with them.
I also agree that the stations need better signage, though. You can be standing at the corner of 7th and Flower, and completely miss the subway entrance. The signage is practically nonexistent, and the signage that *IS* there simply says “7TH STREET/METRO CENTER” which is hard to read and doesn’t really scream out “THERE’S A SUBWAY STATION RIGHT HERE!”
See: http://g.co/maps/t5hmr for the street view.
I know that the station is right there, but I still miss it occasionally.
I don’t have an issue with the seats but the interior of the Red/Purple Line Subway cars are awful, yellow/beige,dingy, lighting included. The need to be upated to look more like the new LRV cars on the Gold Line inside.
i have to say GREAT ARTICLE! i remember when the “RED LINE” first opened in LA it was such a treat. i rode it from hollywood/vine to staples for concerts. i was so hip. then i moved to NYC 3 years ago and WOW! i was in LA for two months this summer where i walked from my apt on los feliz blvd to the sunset/vermont station to take the train to the office in ktown (wilshire/normandie) and i can’t really surprised how many people ride the trains now. it’s wonderful. however, i too was riding the subways in madrid and even in milan, boston, DC and chicago this year and all are fine. NYC is what it is. i’m so used to it. but LA can sure benefit from the plastic “against the wall” seating to increase standing room and MAKE THEM PLASTIC! the NYC trains you showed are the new ones and they just hose them out at night. EASY CLEANING! countdown clocks would be great because in LA the damn monitor was frozen two times saying a train was coming and it was WAY off!
i hope they upgrade. i know they have the money.
How about wood panelling and individual compartments, ala the train in “Harry Potter”?!!! Just kidding.
I think the upholstered seats are OK, but the pattern is very outdated. Ditto on boo-ing the off-white walls, and bad signage.
A bigger issue, I think, is the lack of free transfers. At the very least, I should be able to purchase a transfer up-front during my initial fare purchase, preferable at a discounted rate.
The fabric seats on the subway trains are like the ones installed on Metro buses. They are supposed to be “graffiti proof”.
I agree the fabric seats are gross. I think plastic seats are the way to go.
Yes, I agree our LA Metro Rail system needs an upgrade!!! I wish the seats would be cushier and more comfortable, the Tokyo Metro Subway system in Japan was very clean,spotless(no graffiti!!) and the seats were like sitting on a sofa, very comfy!!! The upholstered seats aren’t bad… Why do we need hard PLASTIC seats?? I was surprised that our Metro rail system didn’t even have a turnstile, for tickets before, instead they have Sheriff Deputies checking to make sure you paid, this means that our Metro system is LOSING FARE REVENUE…. The Countdown system for the next train would be better than the current train schedule display…. LA will have a better Metro system in the FUTURE, give it untill 2020…
How about replace the seats with a leather couch design?? For example the black leather material cushion you see at Bottega Louie
There was an interesting article floating around the web a few months back from the SF Chronicle showing just how many bacteria and germs live on the fabric seats of BART. Granted, the seats on the LA Metro aren’t quite as “plush” as BART, but they can be pretty gross. If riders were respectful and didn’t place feet etc. on seats, it would be less of an issue, but countless people place their feet and dirty shoes on these seats every day (BART has the same issues as I imagine many transit agencies do). Plastic seats could be good for two reasons:
1) They’re easier to keep clean and sanitary in many ways since germs don’t stick quite as easily.
2) They allow for additional seating along the length of the car and for more standing room in the middle as well.
I agree with others here that Metro needs to get with program on the countdown times for the monitors and signage really does need to be improved. The subway is not meant to be a secret! Signage on all stations should be clearly visible and way finding signage in the area should also be clear.
The turnstiles will require staffing, which will cost $20 million per year, so they are never going to be locked. In addition, Metro’s fare-evasion rate without locked turnstiles is 4 percent. New York’s fare-evasion rate, with staffing and locked, hard-to-jump turnstiles is 1.5 percent. Is the $20 million for staff, plus the $46 million for the turnstiles themselves, plus the maintenance of the turnstiles going to be worth it to collect the supposed $6 million LA Metro thinks it is losing in fares?
As for the Breda Heavy-Rail (Subway) cars used on the Red and Purple Lines; Lighten up!
These cars (Breda A650s) were ordered in the late 1980′s from an Italian manufacturer. Think Cadillac Allanté, first-generation Ford Taurus, Rick Astley (no I won’t Rickroll you but that was filmed in 1987) and remember that Miami Vice was still in production.
The cars (New York’s R143s and R160s, Madrid’s 5,6,7,8,and 9000s) you all are giving as examples of what the A650s should look like inside are all from the early 2000′s or later.
Fortunately, the Breda A650s of the Red/Purple Lines are about to undergo a mid-life rebuild, so do get your interior design suggestions into LA Metro ASAP s that they may be considered for the re-building contracts!
Forgot to add that the Light Rail cars you see on the Gold Line here are either the stainless-steel P2550s from 2006 or the white-with-yellow-stripe P2000s from 1996.
Countdown timers? Ha!
I am amused at how often the trains will leave stations ahead of the scheduled time shown on the monitors!
A few more ideas, sometimes echoing what’s already been said:
1. Some station names should be improved to really let riders know where they are; for example, on the Gold Line, instead of “Memorial Park”, meaningless to anyone who doesn’t know Pasadena well, “Old Town/Civic Center”; on the Blue Line, instead of just “Pico”, “Pico/Flower”, or even better, “Pico/Flower-Staples Center”, and instead of “Grand” (where on Grand?), “Washington/Grand-Trade Tech”, etc.
2. Better station signs (as someone mentioned above) that are 3-sided so they can be seen from all directions with much larger letters, and high-contrast between station name and background on the signs (in Little Tokyo in the daytime, try to read, from a distance, the main sign for the station-the letters “Little Tokyo/Arts District” are white on a yellow background-very difficult to read)
3. Use station symbols, such as in the Mexico City system, which is second only to NYC in North America for ridership, with about 1.5 billion people using it a year! Each station has a distinct symbol, based on the name of the station and/or location. Google image search “lance wyman metro station symbols” and you’ll see them-they’re used on all system signage together with the station name-some people respond to symbols better than words, and this responds to that reality.
4. Give each train line a number besides it’s color, like in NYC, and put those on signage as well. Again, you’re giving riders 2 ways to relate to the system: Line 1, Red Line; Line 2, Purple Line, etc.
5. Construct small, secure booths for every station entrance at the ticket-buying level, with live human beings inside to keep an eye on things, answer question, add fare to a ticket, etc. This is normal in Mexico City, NYC, and the Bay Area. When you go into a totally automated station (like all our stations) and can’t find anyone in authority, including an employee in a booth, a sense of safety or of “this place is well run” is not conveyed.
6. Install gates/turnstiles in all stations and get them operational now! Besides increased fare collection, this will also add to a feeling of security and allow the MTA to constantly conduct much more accurate ridership counts.
7. Finally…(an idea I think someone else mentioned) for each station have a series of street-level signs a few blocks away in each direction that say, for example, “Red Line, Pershing Square Station, 3 blocks” with an arrow pointing the right direction, instead of just “Metro Rail” with a “train at a platform” symbol and an arrow, but no info about what line, what station, and how far away.
LA need to provide services to LAX on the greenline with future one-seat ride to downtown LA.
The METRO RAIL need to run later at night Even Minneapolis rail is running until 2am on weekends for CLOSING OF THE BARS DOWNTOWN tHE pURPLE LINE NEED TO EXPAND WITH MORE STATIONS VS